163 Responses to “Crown Forex S.A Bankruptcy Declared Immediately Enforceable”

1. on 13 Jul 2009 at 12:36 pm1khawar

   Dear Francesc,

   I dont understand,”Immediately Enforceable”.Does it mean investors will start getting their funds now or do we have to wait till end of september for the court decision?

2. on 13 Jul 2009 at 4:03 pm2A

   Hi Francesc, thanks for following up on this. Am I reading her response to you correctly?

   FINMA has until August 17 to submit an answering brief to the court based on CF’s appeal and she does not expect decision before end of September, I’m assuming this interpretation is correct so far…

   Well then why does she say that the Bankruptcy of CF has been immediately enforceable if they still have to wait for a response??

   How ridiculous, and she dares to say “to be clear”, do you really want be clear Ms. Sabeti tell your FINMA people to stop wasting our time and money and just give us our deposits back, I’m tired of their half answered ridiculously confusing e-mails…

3. on 13 Jul 2009 at 4:28 pm3Francesc Riverola

   Dear A and Khawar,

   As her response was quite contradictory - they have to wait but decision is immediately enforceable - I decided to copy and paste her response here.

   It sounds to me that as they are the ruler it does not really matter what the court decision will be as the decision has been already taken…. but please, this is my impression, do not take my words for granted as I could be very wrong.

4. on 13 Jul 2009 at 7:55 pm4A

   It’s amazing how unclear this person from FINMA is… I would expect someone working for a government regulatory body to have better communication skills. However, her answer sounds like total bulls#i+.

   If it doesn’t matter what the court decision is then why are they being asked to submit an answering brief?? This makes no sense, I believe this is just another excuse to make this process drag more time.

   And how could the Bankruptcy be declared immediately enforceable when she said that they still have to answer with a brief to the court!

   Francesc could you please forward these questions to this Sabeti person or can you make her e-mail available to us because no one else from FINMA seems to be responding e-mails.

5. on 14 Jul 2009 at 10:23 am5Francesc Riverola

   Hi A,

   I’ll pass your questions to her… I’m sorry but I can not publicly disclose her e-mail. It would be illegal

   Francesc

6. on 14 Jul 2009 at 10:36 am6faisal

   hi A,actually this reply from ms.sabeti tells about the whole mentality of these finma officials.we are faced with heartless and mindless regulators who know nothing apart from playing stupid tricks.i am not able to comprehend that how swiss government can bear such kind of personnel working for their important instituition like “finma” ?????
   its a big question mark on swiss government.

7. on 14 Jul 2009 at 2:16 pm7faisal

   i am not clear about one thing,who are these people,laurent winkelmann,philip von bredow and Yasmin Sabeti.are these people independent lawyers hired by finma or they are full time official finma lawyers?i expect someone from these blogs can clear us about this.may be mr.Francesc or mr.DDa or some one else? i will be thankful.

8. on 14 Jul 2009 at 3:56 pm8Francesc Riverola

   Winkelmann and Von Bredow work for the law firm NOTTER MEGEVAND & PARTNERS in charge of the bankrupcy liquidation process, while Sabeti works for FINMA.

9. on 14 Jul 2009 at 4:22 pm9Goldy

   There is no point of getting mad at FINMA or the liquidator. The whole dang mess should be blame squarely on Crownforex management. If they just play by the rule. Send back fund to customers when requested since early September last year, and fully fund their account as require by new Swiss law, apply for banking license on time, these whole mess would not happen.

   What trigger the investigation and now get into this whole mess was because CF tried to cheat, intimidate and rob their customers of their hard earn money. Even CF want to fully fund their firm and apply for banking license now, it may not happen. After all the irregularity and business ethic violation, how in the world FINMA can grant banking license to CF. Money alone cannot buy everything. Even they have money now, I doubt that the Swiss gov will grant them bank license.

   The best thing for FINMA to do now is to liquidate CF and refund all customers as soon as possible.

10. on 14 Jul 2009 at 6:43 pm10Goldy

    Here is how the process works:

    “With the opening of bankruptcy proceedings the debtor loses his authority to dispose of his assets and all business operations in general come to an immediate and final standstill (= immediately enforceable). According to the Rule of Law the debtor has the right to appeal against such a decision.

    In our case the market in which CF acts is regulated and supervised by the FINAM. FINMA is also competent by law to declare bankruptcy in this sector. According to the Rule of Law CF can appeal in the first instance to the Federal Administrative Court in Bern (www.bundesverwaltungsgericht.ch/) and in the second and last instance to the Federal Supreme Court in Lausanne (www.bger.ch/). Even during these appeal procedures CF has NO authority to dispose of its assets. Only if the appeal of CF would be successful and the Appeal Court would revoke the decision of the FINMA, CF will gain back the authority to dispose of its assets.

    As long as the decision of bankruptcy is not legally binding (res judicata), the liquidators probably will not realize and distribute the assets of CF.”

11. on 15 Jul 2009 at 9:04 am11Mario

    Very True Fransec !!!But they dont have any sort of answers as i have already said there is no proceedings just time killing by finma…finma has no idea what they are doing just because of a small reason they cant collapse a company…I think we all should file a case against finma because they are giving irresponsible text…I dont know where is ibrahim ali and its team there is no response from their side they are quite atleast they should give us some details about the case

12. on 15 Jul 2009 at 9:53 am12faisal

    thanks Francesc for explaining,
    so it means winkelmann and von Bredow are the hired killers.if such kind of reply had been from the side of these two,it could have made some sense because they are been given the task to kill crown and its clients.but such an irresponsible and nonsense response from perssonnel of finma(which claims to be protector of creditors)is or was unthinkable.
    dear Mario i thinkwe are not in a position to file case against Finma.lets see what kind of justice and relief crown forex gets from swiss courts.the bottom line is that continuation of this case even a single day is unjustified,especially when crown authorities seem totally ready to pump capital in their accounts.
    may be we all will be the lucky ones to witness exposing of swiss federal court after witnessing totally naked dirty dancing of finma.

13. on 15 Jul 2009 at 3:19 pm13Goldy

    Folks, don’t be fool by CF propaganda. FINMA and the liquidators are on your side. Sure the proceeding and the court is slow. Yes it is frustrating waiting for the case to move through complex Swiss law and their well known secretive. However, you rather have FINMA facing CF or you have to face CF yourself trying to get your money back. If you are facing CF yourself, you are totally at their mercy.

    Base on some information, CF owner alread setup another forex firm in Cyprus. After this ordeal, I don’t think they want to continue to do business in Switzerland again. So their Swiss banking license deal may be just a ploy to get FINMA to release their asset, then CF would liquidate them, pack up and run. I don’t think they are sincere in getting banking license and continue business as normal under Crownforex. CF reputation in forex community is already been ruined. Most forex community site already brand CF a scam already. So it is make sense for them to create a brand new forex firm that hide their link to CF so that they can get more new unsuspected clients.

    At this point I would say, let Swiss authority do their work. In my view, it is better for FINMA succeed in liquidating CF and distribute fund back to clients than lease the fund and let CF gain bank the control of the money.

14. on 15 Jul 2009 at 4:22 pm14CF Client

    Goldy,thanks for sharing your knowledge about this process. I completely agree with your comments about Crown Forex. I also know for a fact that they’ve opened a new broker in Cyprus because Shadi Swais confessed it to me.

    What do you know about where we go from here in this liquidation process? Apparently CF has already lost control of their website so I’m assuming this is due to the liquidation starting to be enforceable.

    Do you know when and how we would start being refunded our deposits?

    Unfortunatley FINMA representantives are horrible at communicating with us so all this time we’ve had to guess 80% of what’s been happening.

    I know FINMA has been charging $10k USD per day since they started which will probalbly cost CR between $2M - $3M USD, the question is did CF have at least that much in liquid assets to pay FINMA or will they take money from our accounts to pay themselves??

    I just hope CF people don’t try to delay this process further because it will just make us wait even longer to receive our money back.

15. on 15 Jul 2009 at 9:05 pm15Boldy

    hi Goldy,its Boldy here.are you witnessing this case from some other planet?may be jupiters or mars.i will suggest you to come back on earth.you have said liquidators are on the side of clients,what a delicious thought!!we are into 8th month of weighting but yet to see any goods from this authority……hopes are good and i hope at some stage of our life we clients will see some goods from Finma,may be 40% or 50%….my God what a wonderful job this authority is performing from eight months to “save us” from crown forex!!!
    i am fedup and dont want anymore “goods” from this “heavenly authority” finma,just want my deposit back.

16. on 16 Jul 2009 at 4:26 am16Christine

    Do you think there any chance that I won’t get my money back? It is in a custodied account managed by an independent investment firm. The account is in my name and as of yesterday was still active. Thank you.

17. on 16 Jul 2009 at 8:55 am17haris

    if they have opened a new firm in cyprus then what about our funds how we can get them back can somebuddy please explain?

18. on 16 Jul 2009 at 3:08 pm18faisal

    i dont want to indulge between Goldy and Boldy.both of them seem like funny characters of some humerous film.
    i just want my funds back and my funds are been held back by Finma for no reason.if finma and crown have some issues,we clients have nothing to do with that.it is just like as if some one snacthes money from other person and runs away showing him his ass.

19. on 16 Jul 2009 at 3:13 pm19Goldy

    Hello everyone:

    I want to straight out a few points here.

    About how much FINMA and their lawyers charge per day. I heard this 10k per day charge very often, but where did you get this information, do you have official word from FINMA and their lawyers that they charge 10k per day or you hear it from Mr. Swais? The misinformation designed to scare the clients to hate the regulators as CF hate them because FINMA stop their illegal and unethical activities.

    I don’t know about the Swiss process, but I know the fact that in the US, a similar liquidation of a forex firm cost around 200 to 300k USD. After the liquidation is completely legal binding, the receiver can transfer clients accounts and fund to other forex firm that interested in accepting those accounts, and it is the forex brokerage firms who accept or purchase those accounts are responsible for paying the receiver the fee, thus mostly leave clients fund 100% intact.

    About the liquidation process. It also take almost a year to complete the liquidation process in the US. Of course in a country that have law and justice, it take time for the case to do through the legal system. It is not like in China they can execute a man in few weeks. In the US and in Europe it would take months and years to convict a criminal.

    Taking time through legal process doesn’t mean the authority is corrupt or the legal system is corrupt, but this time taking process is ensure justice for everyone, to the victims and to the accused. In CF’s case, the Swiss legal system is giving CF time to appeal until they exhaust all the mean to continue.

    So this case end quickly or not, is not depend on FINMA or their lawyers, it is depend on CF itself. If CF want to drag this on, it can be a long time before we see our money again. However, if they just let go, allowing other forex firm to buy their clients’ account, I think the regulators will likely to accept that deal, and everyone can get their money back quicker. Or the clients can have the option of keeping their fund with the new firm and continue their forex trading there. That kind of deal happen almost 100% of the time in the US when a forex firm liquidated, other big and stronger brokers are always ready to buy the accounts.

20. on 16 Jul 2009 at 9:00 pm20CF Client

    I agree with your comments Goldy.

    I really hope Shadi Swais and Ibrahim Ali stop trying to make this process longer because it is causing much pain.

    Enough is enough… if their appeal has been denied then they need to take responsibility and allow us clients to move on.

    I know of more than one broker that offered to buy out the clients back in March and they declined the offer. At this stage it would be very selfish for Crown to keep this process going specially since they are already operating another broker from Cyprus.

    Some times it seems like people here take sides. Some bash FINMA other defend Crown and vice-versa, but I’m sure you would all agree that the priority is to recover our funds, whether CF is allowed to go back to business ir irrelevant because there is no way I would continue using them.

21. on 16 Jul 2009 at 9:33 pm21hoosier

    CF Client

    I totally agree, what is frustrating is the lack of communication and explanation from FINMA. At least if they showed some appreciation of our situation.

    I don’t know about anyone else, but the emails I get from them come across as aggressive and almost as if it’s a real effort to even be bothered with me.

    That might be a translation problem, but I don’t think so. As far as I am concerned FINMA like the FSA in the UK are there to protect the public whatever nationality and unfortunately they just don’t give that impression.

    That combined with spurious comments from Crown and snippets of info from various people and lawyers, you can’t help but feel at a loss as to who to blame.

    Bottom line is we didn’t cause this problem but we are the ones paying for it. My own personal opinion is that if FINMA hadn’t stepped in I would have all my funds back by now. In fact Crown had processed the withdrawal the day FINMA stepped in. Previous to that I had received a large withdrawal from Crown three weeks prior. How I wish I had withdrawn the lot!!

22. on 16 Jul 2009 at 9:34 pm22Boldy

    hi Goldy,i can only admire your dermination for your cause…keep it up
    please come out of your U.S forex firm experience,that was different time different situation different country and different people.
    please please read this case from the begining.
    do you know 0n 23rd feb.2009 finma took its first decision and after three months of court proceedings these corrupt investigators realized that they need to change their decision?and on 18th may they brought a new decision the “bankruptcy decision”.so four months got consumed in this change of decision?
    do you know crown forex was fully operational uptill 18th may under finma investigations?
    do you mean finma investigators were blind who let crown forex continue working if there were any misapropriation charges against cfsa?
    do you have any knowledge of official misapropriation charges against cfsa?
    do you know finma’s first decision on 23rd feb was “liquidation” and on 18th may they changed their decision from liquidation to “bankruptcy”?
    do you mean bankruptcy imposed on crown will be good for the health of cfsa clients?
    do you want that we clients should praise finma for the wonders which it is performing from eight months.
    i believe we clients should keep ourselves ready for filing a case against finma because we might need it in next few months time if by hook and crook cfsa does not comes out victorious.

23. on 16 Jul 2009 at 10:13 pm23Goldy

    Hoosier:

    Well, lucky for you that you get some fund back from CF. Some people request for fund since early September 2008 and got nothing back. CF simple just refuse to return the fund. Some other time they intimidate clients to give up a big portion of their fund through back charge swap and other illegal mean. I know one guy from Australia were forced to give up 100k and out of his 150k account. They said that he either accept 50k or they are not going to send him anything.

    These kind of illegal and down right unethical business practice and got CF in trouble with the regulator.

    Now if they care about clients fund as they claim to be, then just make the deal and let other broker buy the accounts, then this legal mess will be over and clients will have option to continue to trade with the new broker or withdraw their fund.

24. on 16 Jul 2009 at 11:33 pm24Tiger

    I agree with the comments against CF, if CF has good business practices they wont be in the couts now.

    They msut have done something which trigger FINMA to jump in. And as FINMA has control over the money of CF , CF folks are trying to get into business again, but what is the gaurentee that they will return the deposits to clients. If they get the CF back they can file for bankcurrptcy and walk away with all our funds.

    It is in the best interest of clients to have FINMA in control of CF and liquidate it, as Goldy mentioned that the legal process is slow and take time, so we have to be patient and hope for the best.

    I dont trust CF folks at all, FINMA I am not sure but being a government body they have lot of risk, so they have to protect their name.

    For liquidators its just another case, they make money and away, they wont care for company or clients.

    The tactics used by CF to delay the case again and again by repeated appeals is just foolish cry, they were practicing the wrong business approach and thinking they can do whatever they want.

    I wish FINMA can do better job with openly communicating the process and accusations, but I think they are legally challenged as well to certain extent. CF can cry wolf but thats not the expectation from FINMA nor they will try to do that.

25. on 17 Jul 2009 at 12:14 am25hoosier

    I do agree with your comments, the only thing I find strange is, if this is such an open and shut case as FINMA seem to indicate, why the courts are granting appeals.

    In other cases I have seen the courts have ignored blatant timewasting appeals and sort the best deal for the creditors.

    Take FXQL in the US for example. We knew exactly what the problems were with the company, we were kept informed as to the progress of the court case and what the possible outcomes were.

    Here we are just left to speculate. I appreciate these things take time as did the FXQL case. Lets be honest we have no real information only speculation as to what is going on. I wish FINMA could give us a bit of confidence in them

26. on 17 Jul 2009 at 1:01 am26Goldy

    Hoosier:

    Man, are we an unlucky bunch or what! I got some fund stuck with FXLQ too, but luckily, at the end, I got every penny back.

    With FXLQ, the receiver couldn’t tell us much either. We do not know if we were going to receive our money back or not at all, until the end that we know they transfer our account to GFT and that we can withdraw 100% of our fund or continue trading at GFT.

    In fxlq case, Robert Gray continue to fight and appeal in court many times too, but at the end he lost, and thus the court decide to let the receiver transfer our account to those brokers who want to buy them.

    I hope CF’s case will turn out to be similar to fxlq, it worth to wait if at the end we get our money back.

27. on 17 Jul 2009 at 10:05 am27haris

    Goldy is that confirm that CF has opened a new firm in cyprus? and plz tell me who has confirmed it.

28. on 17 Jul 2009 at 1:11 pm28Boldy

    Goldy i can make logicless and senseless noice may be more than you.atleast have one sensible logic to go against crown forex and in favour of finma.
    do you want that crown clients should favour bankruptcy decision may be you can but not a real account holder with crown.

29. on 17 Jul 2009 at 1:36 pm29faisal

    dear hoosier nice to hear from you after long time.it will be nice if all the real clients of cfsa keep in touch.
    Boldy i admire you for nice and logical thoughts in post no.22.thanks for correcting us against terrible noice.and my nice dear Goldy i can only pray for you,no other medicine available.

30. on 17 Jul 2009 at 3:28 pm30Goldy

    To make it clear, I am a real CF client, a big one too, Mr. Francesc Riverola, the owner of fxstreet can confirm this. I don’t use my real name here to protect my identity. All my post are base on real personal experience dealing with CF management for all these years and first hand account from other real CF clients.

    I also want to be clear that I have no personal agenda to spread hatred toward anyone, not to CF or FINMA. I only want to speak the truth and share my experience and knowledge to my fellow who are victims in this case.

    The bottom line is, I don’t care who is right or wrong, I have no love or hatred toward FINMA or CF, I just want my money back, that’s all.

    There are a lot of thing that we as CF’s customers do not know what’s going on behind the scene between FINMA and CF. During the investigation, FINMA said CF do not cooperate with their investigation, CF try everything to hide and evade. CF on the other hand accuse FINMA of abusing power and that they do not follow the law.

    With all these confusion, let us break it down to simple step. Who is the cause of this mess in the first place!

    There are many forex brokers operating in Switzerland. None that I know of has been shut down and investigate like CF. Those broker that big enough to apply for banking license apply for one and continue their business, those who cannot afford to do it, move their business somewhere else but keep their clients account intact, and keep paying them when request for fund.

    Only CF get in trouble, why?!, Well, I said many time, it is not FINMA hate CF and target them, it is CF bad business practices that cause this trouble and create this big mess. In this business, trust is everything, and when a broker breach this trust by disable clients account arbitrary, not send back fund to clients when requested, intimidate and rob clients of their hard earn money, these kind of thing that cause the regulatory agency such as FINMA to step in and do the investigation. And when they found what an internal mess CF is operating, then they have no other choice but to decide liquidate this firm.

    Those clients who still defending CF, that they are innocent, may be you do not know enough what’s going inside. I know quite a bit because I fight with them for months to get my money back before FINMA step in. Under their mercy I lost hope to get my fund back, but I was determine, I was prepare to go to court to fight them if I have to. Now FINMA step in, so the odd is better for me, now it is not just me who say CF management are crooks and cheaters and they practice unethical business, the government regulators also found irregularity and decide to shut down CF.

    So to me it doesn’t matter. If FINMA won, then good, I don’t have to spend too much legal fee to fight. If CF won, I hope the court, set a condition for them to pay clients first before they can again control of their assets and continue their banking license application. But the way I see it, CF has a very slim chance of winning the appeal base on the overwhelming evidence of bad business practice, no court or regulatory agency in Switzerland will grant them bank license.

31. on 17 Jul 2009 at 3:45 pm31faisal

    Goldy thanks for confirming that you are same old Ramsey.it is nice that you have admitted it by yourself.although it was not required anymore.welcome back again,and keep “helping” us with your “wisdom”.

32. on 17 Jul 2009 at 4:44 pm32hoosier

    Faisal

    Thanks for the welcome

    Just to advise if Goldy is Ramsey, I know who Ramsey is and can vouch for him to be a totally genuine trader.

    I think we should stop having a go at each other. We are all owed money from Crown Forex and like Goldy I really don’t care who is to blame as long as I get my money back.

    We should spend our efforts on that cause and that cause alone

33. on 17 Jul 2009 at 5:19 pm33CF Client

    I agree. We should all be on the same side and with one goal in mind, recovering our money.

    The big problem here is we receive no communication from CF or FINMA. CF website is no longer accessible and FINMA does not respond to my e-mails any more…

    What does it take for FINMA to take us seriously and keep us in the loop of this case?

    I believe this should be our priority at this point. We have to figure out a way for all of us to come together and make FINMA understand they must take us seriously.

    Any ideas?

34. on 17 Jul 2009 at 5:58 pm34Goldy

    Hello Friends,

    In my humble opinion, I have no better wisdom than the rest of you. If I was so smart, I wouldn’t do business with CF and got my fund stuck there. May be by nature I have too much trust in integrity and sincerity of humanity. But when this trust is violated, it’s hurt, not just financially, but it damage the trust of our fellow man and this forex business.

    So I must admit that none of us can see the future. In this business we must accept a certain degree of risk. Risk to the market when we trade, and risk to the broker if they cheat.

    At this point nothing much we can do but to wait for the result from the court. I hope that CF would end it here when the court decide, and I hope they don’t drag this case up to Swiss supreme court. If they want, they can re appeal up to supreme court. They have that right.

    So like I said, this case will end shortly or will drag on for a long time depend of CF and what they will do next. Even the liquidation is immediate enforceable and FINMA got control of all CF asset, they cannot realize it and disburse fund back to us until CF end their appeal.

    For US citizen, may be we can call or write to CFTC and inform them of this issue, may be they will work on our behalf to open a better communication with FINMA.

35. on 17 Jul 2009 at 8:40 pm35faisal

    dear Hoosier and cf client,
    i totally agree with both of you.
    i do not care Ramsey is Goldy or Goldy is Ramsey.whatever he is my “sympathies” will always remain with him. every one has his/her own wisdom and no one can be fooled.
    we clients are faced with extreme serious situation of our life time,our hard work of years is at stakes and i believe we should take things seriously to get 100% of our funds back and should not get traped in that Ramsey is Goldy or Goldy is Ramsey.
    best of luck to all of us

36. on 19 Jul 2009 at 11:46 pm36Eagle

    Dear All,

    I ve been following your inserts since the start of the investigation and I didnt make any previous insertion. but now i found it imp to speak some info out to prevent new clients from becoming victims.

    I m one of the vistims of CF case and I have some confirmed and uptodate information about them.
    1- CF is 100% the new cypriot broker fxpulp, i even know the name of the laywer who worked for the license for them
    Shadi sweis and Ibrahim Ali hasanain and this is the complete name of the chariman were in cyprus all these days building their new scaming broker instead of worrying about our money.
    2- CF has build its own trading software they call it blue trader and they run it from Jordan. so they can avoid using meta trader and being under others control. in addition they started selling this software to other brokers in order to gain the details of their clients. (evil thinking)
    3- CF staff have completely left switzerland and there is no more physical present for them in this country all staff are either in Jordan or in cyprus now.
    4- CF management might stop runing the meta trader version of CF so they can prevent the FINMA from confirming the balance of the victims clients.
    5- CF started in early 2008 to receive funds from clients to its new bank details in cyprus instead of switzerland which shows with no doubt that they felt they were in trouble since that time and they were preparing to move to cyprus to make a new broker but Finma decision to offer banking license make them greed and wanted that step. most of CF clients money were out of switzerland since 2008 but only the injected new capital remained there so that Finma has that strong power by handling those fund

    and still i have more less imp details.

    I hope my briefing were useful for all of you, and had clarified some issues and I hope we can be united against those scammers to have our money back, and sorry for being late in writing but again when i learned about FXpulp i found it urgent to speak out to protect others from being victims.

    My message to CF management: it s only by being honest and returning people’s money you can have a clean record not by running away, or changing the country or changing the name of the broker, or changing the address of the co, or creating trading software neither by thinking you are smarter than all your clients. IT S ONLY BY BEING HONEST and respecting your clients.

    I also have some ideas about how to make useful and painful steps against CF management but unfortunatly it cannot be discussed here while this management can read it and be aware of it.

    Finaly Thanks Francesc for this wonderful and excellent website of FXstreet , please keep up this honest and unique performance.

37. on 20 Jul 2009 at 9:46 am37faisal

    hi Eagle,thanks for trying to “save us” from cfsa after eight months…so nice of you
    i have one simple question to you .is it some ginies who have filed appeals in swiss federal court against finma decision of bankruptcy?
    i am not here to prove a point nor i have any personal vengeance towards any body.we are here to find facts not rumours.
    if crown forex has to leave suisse or to stay,we clients have nothing to do with that.
    we all know that crown was fully operational under finma investigations uptill 18th may.and we all know that crown forex has appealed finma decision.
    now suppose even if crown authorities have left suisse after eight months,responsibility will fall directly on finma.
    actually finma’s decision bankruptcy had lost every legality and morality the day (10th june) crown filed appeal against this decision.now if finma robs us and does not pay 100% of our funds back,they will have to go against every possible norm of humanity and civilization.

38. on 20 Jul 2009 at 10:35 am38Eagle

    Dear Faisal,

    Simply it is not genies who filed appeales it is the lawyers of Cf who are trying to have back the injected capital to get percentage of it. but the whole staff and management are out of switzerland the day after the investigation was finished. they simply dont want to hear any more clients voices unfortunatly. and instead of sending emails to clients updating and explaining the situattion to them they contacted them through the new name of fxpulp to get some more funds from us.

    as I said in my previous insertion we have some movements options but unfortunatly it has to be confidential. Do you have any idea Francesc if we can make these ideas exchange more confidential and spread only between real CF victims.

    and again thank you Francesc for your dedicated work.

39. on 20 Jul 2009 at 11:56 am39FRiverola

    Dear Eagle,

    Thanks for your kind words. At this time I’m not planning to make any move till there is a resolution of the court case and I see results from the bankrupcy liquidation process.

    We have waited for so long so my position is to stay hold for a little bit longer.

    If you think otherwise, please let me know.

40. on 20 Jul 2009 at 12:05 pm40hoosier

    Eagle

    thanks for the information. Do you believe there are sufficient funds still in Switzerland to settle all claims?

41. on 21 Jul 2009 at 12:40 am41Eagle

    Dear Hoosier
    Yes I do beleive there is sufficient fund, according to press release in middle of 2008 CF had injected 5 million swiss francs to raise its capital to apply for the banking license and this is why I believe CF were not expecting those money to be freezed.

    Dear Francesc,
    I totaly agree with this policy, I believe we have to wait the court decision, what i meant is when we need to discuss further options in the future it has to be confidential and circulated between CF victim clients only.

    one of my simple suggestion for the time being is if we can elect someone like urself to go and meet Finma representative in Geneva and explain them all the details and our situation and our feedback from their performance and we share all the cost between us. and propably appointing a lawyer on behalf of all of us who want to participate in this and grant him a certain percentage of the fund recovered, at least we can have someone officialy appointed to update us.
    We need to hear all others opinions on this.

42. on 21 Jul 2009 at 12:51 am42Eagle

    Precise info: the capital increase was for 4.5 mil Francs and it was dated on the 10th of November 2008 a few weeks before the investigation started.
    this piece of info is also avaialbe on Fxstreet, posted the same day 10th of November, I hope Francesc can confirm it.

43. on 21 Jul 2009 at 10:34 am43Francesc Riverola

    Hi Eagle

    Yes I did publish the capital increase a few months ago when I was informed by Mr. Shadi Swais, CF CEO.
    About going to Switzerland in behalf of CF clients… well, could be something to consider indeed if things does not turn toward us.
    If further action must be taken that goes beyond this blog, Eagle do count on me.

44. on 21 Jul 2009 at 10:46 pm44Goldy

    Hello Eagle:

    Thanks for sharing with us all those information. We are in this together, thus we should unite and help each other out.

    From my own experience, CF management are not honest, and they tried to do many unethical things to rob our money. I’m not surprise that they would try to shut down their MT4 server, disable our accounts and wipe our balance clean. I hope FINMA deploy some measure to protect clients accounts from being wipe out or destroy by CF. In any case, I think those who still can login to their account, should make print screen copy of their account that show account balance and equity. Just in case anything happen, you still have some proof that you account at CF exist and how much money you have in that account. So that we can claim it when FINMA disburse the fund at the end of liquidation.

    As for the 4.5 mil Francs, this is what CF claimed, but can anyone have any third party verify this number. If FINMA is able to freez this fund, that’s good. May be this is the reason why CF is so scare and try everything possible to regain the control of their asset. However, i don’t think they are honest and want to get bank license. They may just want to gain control of their fund, move it to their Jordan or cyprus account and disappear.

    In my opinion, I rather have FINMA liquidate CF asset and give us back the money rather have CF regain control of their asset and we have to beg them for mercy to give us our money back, that’s is not going to happen.

45. on 21 Jul 2009 at 11:34 pm45kribojay

    This is the first time I have been on this site. I have also been involved in the cf mess.

46. on 22 Jul 2009 at 8:05 pm46Leo CF client

    Just to say that I still have access to my trading account and can still trade although the real money has become virtual money

47. on 22 Jul 2009 at 11:35 pm47Mario

    Hi Nice Info Eagle agreed about what you said about the software but i have confirmed from my sources to be very honest they dont have any chance to run from suisse.we the real account holder can come on one point is file a case against them in the court to just release our withdrawals we dont have time for this mess and about fxpulp still there is no confirmation that as if it is another cf cant say anything really see there are many softwares that are running in different companies and guys see i have one question on my mind why is cf struggling for saving bankruptcy? i want everyone to put their input..the answer i have is they want to work on because huge funds is on the hands of finma …

48. on 23 Jul 2009 at 10:42 am48Francesc Riverola

    Guys

    Can you provide proofs that CF is now FX Pulp?

    Thanks

49. on 23 Jul 2009 at 6:53 pm49khawar

    Dear francesc,

    With all due respect and no offence at all,I think you are in a better position to investigate the proof.I see a big banner on FXStreet.Com of FXPULP…

50. on 24 Jul 2009 at 11:12 am50A

    thanks for the info Eagle. I had a chat with the live chat section on the fxpulp. I tool buttons wasnt working on the top (contact us). Then when i asked who were the owners of the site and how long they been in business, it was with much hesitation. The ‘chat’ person said that they were in business for a year but if you want any info then you would have to email info@fxpulp.com. I suggest for starters to flood the chat and email (with spam maill to prevent somebody from getting burned by that company…… Maybe have a date and time for everybody to contact bombard their mail. The person couldn’t even tell me one name of the company’s owners and there isn’t any information on the site about directors. Then i left a piece of my mind. Felt great.

51. on 24 Jul 2009 at 12:06 pm51Eagle

    Dear Francesc,

    To be honest I was so disappointed to see the adv of fxpulp on fxstreet, I believed in Fxstreet as an honest source for forex trading, and it s not worth it to risk your excellent reputation. as for proof please go to http://www.crownit.com (this is the it company of crown that developed the trading software in Jordan) and select the product of forex trading software, when you download you will find it s the same fxpulp. please do that before they can delete it. In addition ask the cypriot authorities to provide you the names of the licensee. it is very obvious for those who wants to believe. I will my faith up with fxstreet for not helping scammers, CF management just think they are smarter than everybody else.

52. on 24 Jul 2009 at 2:59 pm52Goldy

    Francesc, as the owner of this respectable fxstreet.com, you have more leverage to ask fxpulp to produce the list of names of their owner, board of directors, and management staff. If you fail to give you the names, you may want to tell them that you are going to pull their ads from this site.

    Folks, if we have a solid proof that CF is now fxpulp, we should make this information known to all other forex traders at other forex community sites.

53. on 24 Jul 2009 at 3:01 pm53Goldy

    Correction:

    If they failed to give you the names,you may want to tell them that you are going to pull their ads from this site.

54. on 24 Jul 2009 at 4:28 pm54CF Client

    Guys I also believe its important that we try to figure out if CF is FXPULP and stop them from getting more victims, however, let’s keep our priority getting our money back.

    “A” gave me an idea from his post above when he mentioned flooding FXPULP with Spam email. Let’s all agree on specific dates to bombard FINMA with emails and phone calls. We need to put the pressure on these people.

    They need to feel our presence and know they must take us seriously. These people are not doing their job of keeping us informed and I’m tired of it!

    I say we begin this “LET’S GET OUR MONEY BACK CAMPAIGN” this upcoming monday July 27.

    I have the e-mail addresses to about 8 different clowns at FINMA so forward the same e-mail u will send to everyone.

    Make your e-mails clear and to the point so its harder for them to give a bullshit answer as they usually do.

    Once we receive a response to these emails let’s compare the answers from FINMA and decide when to do this all over again. We must take action on this situation guys, chatting in these blogs alone is not going to get us our money back.

    Send the emails monday and let’s put the pressure on FINMA!!

55. on 24 Jul 2009 at 5:28 pm55Goldy

    Sure I agree, our main focus is to get our money back. Yes, we should keep bugging FINMA and the Liquidators to speed up their work and to give up more update as the law permit.

    However, I also would like to point out that FINMA is limit by Swiss law and the legal system. I think getting our money back quick or long is not depend so much on FINMA but on how CF want to drag this case on. If they want to drag it on, nothing FINMA can do about it but to wait to reply to every level of court where CF appeal to. At this time we know that CF is appealing at Swiss Federal court and FINMA is preparing their reply to that appeal.

    Now if the court rule against CF, and CF want to appeal again to the supreme court, then they can, and FINMA cannot do anything about it, but to wait for the court and issue reply again. That may take months.

    While this legal process is going on, FINMA cannot realize CF asset or make disbursement of fund back to us. And FINMA also limit by the law of how much they can tell us creditors while this legal process is going on between CF and FINMA. Until this process is over, then FINMA can openly tell us everything and only then that they can liquidate CF asset and disburse fund back to us.

    So this case end quick or long is depend more on CF and less with FINMA. If CF care about their clients, they can allow bigger broker to buy their clients’ accounts, and move our account and fund to the new broker. Then we can withdraw fund or continue trading there. If they agree to this kind of deal, FINMA is likely to approve. This kind of situation happen very often in the US when a smaller firm is in trouble and the bigger broker step in to buy the accounts.

    So do whatever we suppose to do, but keep all the facts above in mind, so that we don’t get frustrated and blame the wrong guy.

56. on 24 Jul 2009 at 8:08 pm56A

    I understand what Goldy is saying and appreciate the patience he has. I agree with CF Client…..lets still spam them on the same date. Not so much for the reason to get our money back as quickly as possible (although that would be a bonus)…..but for the simple reason for them to acknowledge us……even if it means that they send us at LEAST 2 emails a month to let us know what is going on or SOMETHING. I haven’t received ANY emails. If if wasn’t for the fact for this site, i wouldn’t haven’t known nothing. You want to keep the fire down from a burning building…..throw some water at it! Thats what i’m saying. (Still in favor of flooding fxpulp to). At least if they want to do business, at least we can pressure them into STOP litigating and continuing their appeals to block us from getting our money.

57. on 24 Jul 2009 at 8:08 pm57Annie

    Sorry about that…..my name is Annie

58. on 26 Jul 2009 at 9:09 am58Hoosier

    If you want to email FINMA then there are several questions that need answering:

    1. If FINMA have the power to freeze assets, why did they not possess the power to shut Crown down completely e.g. close the building, stop any employees talking to customers, stop Crown from taking on new customers, stop customers from trading, suspend the website. Surely all these things could have been done with a court order. They knew about them all because everyone was telling them. I personally emailed them on several occasions.

    2. FINMA spent several months auditing/investigating Crown, which means they would have had a full financial picture in February. Why did they decide to pursue crown through the courts over whatever error and misdemeanors they found when doing the audit, only to change their minds several months later and go for full bankruptcy of the company. If they knew the financial position at the start, why didn’t they just apply for bankruptcy straight away?

    3. The worst thing in my view is that customers were allowed by FINMA to continue trading from December 2008 right up to May 19th 2009. Now lets assume that Crown were honest and normally hedged or offset all customer trades. If their assets were frozen for that period, how could they have offset or hedged any trades that were placed. Does it mean for that period Crown were totally exposed. Could Crowns financial situation have been made hugely worse by FINMA?

    4. Several people have commented that Crown can keep appealing all these decisions. But people seem to forget one thing, you actually have to have evidence for an appeal to be made and successful . A swiss judge has to have seen evidence that leads him to believe 1. Crown has enough funds not to be bankrupt 2. Crown has evidence that they have not been naughty boys

    Don’t get me wrong guys. I trust Crown Forex about as far as I can throw them, but there are some serious questions that FINMA need to address and despite requests I have never received any answers. In my view FINMA should have suspended Crown completely from day 1 and if the financial situation was a dire as they are making out applied for bankruptcy there and then.

    I don’t know about anyone else, but none of this makes any logical sense and I am very worried that FINMA has dragged this situation out alot longer than it needed to be and made the financial situation of Crown alot worse than it was.

    I appreciate comments

59. on 26 Jul 2009 at 7:28 pm59Goldy

    Hoosier:

    Thanks for your thoughtful input.

    There are a lot of things that we do not know. FINMA never reveal to us about CF financial situation and what kind irregularities they found there.

    The way I see it, FINMA do things differently from US regulator. Here in the US, the NFA is responsible to do initial investigation of their members firms. And once they found enough evidence that they must shutdown a firm, then they would refer the case to CFTC, which has authority like FINMA, to get the case through legal system and to appoint the Receiver. At that point, the information is made public and the firms’website would be shutdown with notice that the firm is under the investigation.

    In Switzerland, FINMA seem to move much slower than the NFA and CFTC in the US. However, we do not know what was going on behind the scene. The investigators complained that CF try everything to hide, evade, and block their investigation at every turn. This may slow their work down significantly. After dealing with CF management for a long time, I have no question that those sneaky CF people can make hell for the investigators.

    Now we have to wait and see if they can convince the judge to over turn this liquidation. I think their chance is very slim. If CF won, I fear that our fund is in greater danger than in the hands of FINMA.

60. on 27 Jul 2009 at 6:40 am60Annie

    FINMA didn’t try to hard to do anything in my opinion. I would think that they would BLOCK any transaction going into or out of their bank account. On May 19 FINMA put them in bankruptcy….had this going on since January/February. I PUT a LARGE deposit into crown on May 15, 2009 (unknowing to me of anything). I have had this crown account for over a year. That transaction went in free and clear. If FINMA was on their job in the simpliest terms, they could have for starters….shut the bank account DOWN and HELD everyones money until everything got sorted out. Otherwise…I would not have been able to submit my deposit 4 days before that dismal day. You can’t make a deposit in a bank account that closed. So in my opinion FINMA is just as big as a crook as Crown for the fact that they cant even do a simple job. I understand ’slowness’…. AFTER you start from the back end ….THE BANK.

61. on 27 Jul 2009 at 4:00 pm61Boldy

    Hoosier,
    i appreciate your observation,every thing that you have stated in your post makes sense.
    i can see some kind of detective mission going on at these blogs.it seems like i am watching some James Bond film.
    one rumour being spread is that crown authorities have left suisse and i have also listened about name of Fxpulp many a times.
    if supposedly fxpulp is owned by crown directors and if it is really a crime to own two forex firms at the same time then what winkelmann and von Bredow are doing,and what is going on in swiss federal court,is it some kind of lawyers competetion going on?why swiss courts have suspended finma’s bankruptcy decision and why Yasmin sabeti tells us that case is in court and decision is expected in the end of september.
    i think it is time that Finma terminates winkelmann and Von Bredow and appoints mr.Goldy at the place of both of them because mr.Goldy is a person two in one(Goldy and Ramsay at the same time).i hope finma will benefit from this big discount offer.
    anyways it is light hearted otherwise Goldy is a nice fellow who actually have helped us to find truth.

62. on 27 Jul 2009 at 4:34 pm62faisal

    dear Hoosier i agree with every bit of your post.
    i dont know how much credibility matters to others but for me credibility is every thing.
    i just dont understand how to go against crown forex when my funds and others funds are been held back by finma when we clients are been denied every right to infirmation by finma when finma investigators have used every negative tactic to delay this case when finma wants to declare bankruptcy on crown.
    i had positive thoughts that through these blogs we clients can exert some kind of pressure on swiss govt.and finma to treat us seriously but i think all the efforts have gone in to dustbin.now probably we clients have to sit and wait at the mercy of finma investigators.
    lets all hope for good

63. on 27 Jul 2009 at 11:03 pm63B E

    Francesc, you are doing a great job for us. Keep doing it! Please inform us about the Court decision, when it becomes available.
    Also special thanks to Goldy for clarifying the situation.

64. on 28 Jul 2009 at 4:50 pm64Ping

    Dear Francesc,

    Could you send email to ask them when could we get our money.

    I am very anxious whether can we get the money or not.

    Ping

65. on 29 Jul 2009 at 7:35 am65CF Client

    Interesting Article related to the Crown Forex disaster.

    http://www.startribune.com/business/51630292.html?elr=KArks7PYDiaK7DUoaK7D_V_eDc87DUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aU7DYaGEP7vDEh7P:DiUs

66. on 29 Jul 2009 at 7:44 am66CF Client

    Another related Article in French:

    http://www.rfj.ch/rfj/Actualite/Regionale/15709Le-decompte-se-poursuit-apres-la-faillite-de-Crown-Forex.html

    When is this going to end??

    Did anyone e-mail FINMA on monday? Has anyone received a response?

67. on 29 Jul 2009 at 11:54 am67haris

    can anybudy explain that article in english.

68. on 29 Jul 2009 at 7:02 pm68CF Client

    Hi Haris,

    The english article talks about a lawsuit originated in the US from some clients that got ripped off by an Investment company that promised its clients a 10% annual return. This investment company operated an arbitrage account in which they earned a low risk return based on the interest rate differential between currencies like the AUD and the YEN.

    This investment company has told their clients that the reason why they are not able to withdraw funds is because of Crown Forex Investigation. Apparently the attorney representing these victims contacted the FINMA investigators and they said that those clients account dont exist.

    I know for a fact that this Investment company does have money with Crown Forex because I have inside information about this and also some illegal activity that they both had going on.

    Still this information does not offer us any solutions but at least we are seeing that this situtaion is getting more media recognition.

    I have contacted FINMA for an update on the status and still no response.

    Has anyone received any responses???

69. on 30 Jul 2009 at 12:31 am69B E (cf client)

    Hi, Haris
    Here is what the French article is about:
    Still no concrete data concerning the bankruptcy of Crown Forex.
    Creditors had till the end of June to file their financial claims.
    The advocates charged with liquidation of the company have received around 3000 e-mails concerning this situation, but now they want to examine them all before making conclusions…

    (Now I’ll jump ahead because this article just repeats what we all know already)
    … Crown Forex was declared bankrupt because of the debts and the claims against it that largely depass the value of its assets.
    The management of the company has demanded the suspension in front of the Federal Administrative Tribunal to avoid the immediate effect of the bankruptcy, but their request was rejected.
    (here again less important data: Crown still occupies the offices and the manager was seen there, although the liquidators have told him he has nothing to do there any more)…
    That is essentially it. If you spot another article in French, provide the link please and I’ll try my best to translate it.

70. on 30 Jul 2009 at 3:37 am70Goldy

    Thanks for the article. With this kind of media coverage, I hope CFTC would step forward and get involve or at least work with FINMA on behalf of US clients to recover our fund.

    For the legal process, we don’t expect to hear anything much until at least September this year. Then we would know if the Swiss Federal court decide in favor of FINMA or CF. If FINMA won, then the liquidation is binding and they can proceed to disbursement of fund. If CF decide to appeal to supreme court, then again, who know this legal process will end. I just hope CF and their lawyers come to their senses and let the clients have their fund back.

71. on 30 Jul 2009 at 5:04 pm71haris

    Thank you CF Client for explaining. We all should wait and pray to god for good.

72. on 30 Jul 2009 at 7:45 pm72khawar abbasi

    I have been reading all the posts..Thanks to all for their contributions..I see this blog not more than a punching bag where everyone can throw the punch without any results!

    Bottom line,we can bring out our anger and disgest about crown forex and FINMA,but are unable to do anything or gain any thing from this blog!

    I will be honest here as an investor of CF..I invested in CF partly because it appears in FXstreet.com choice of brokers!

    The problem arised and was notified to fxstreet.com..Mr.Goldy or Mr.Ramsey whatever got into problem.

    FXstreet.com advised Mr.goldy or ramsey to file a case against CF without disclosing the status of the broker it advertised on the street!

    So in my opinion,if only fxstreet has made that critical information public through this blog,many of us like me who invested in CF without knowing the true situation could have been saved!

    I hold this street equally responsible for the mess!

    For few dollars rebates and advertising fee,the information was not made public since the problem
    arised for the good of all investorsof CF..

    In my opinion,as an IB and advertiser of various brokers,this street have some responsibility!

73. on 31 Jul 2009 at 5:41 pm73Francesc Riverola

    Dear Mr. Abbasi

    I’m truly sorry to read that you consider FXstreet.com equally responsible of CF mess.

    We only accept in our list firms fully regulated in the US, UK, Australia, Japan, Nordic Countries and Switzerland. So far, EU passport brokers are not allowed in the list.

    We included Switzerland a few years ago as their brokers were representing a big part of the retail industry, even though it was an unregulated market, so we thought it did not make any sense not to accept in the list some of the most important players in this industry back then.

    While a broker remains in the list, we monitor the web to make sure brokers play honestly with traders. That task of monitoring mostly is on me, as I consider it a part of my job.

    We also intervine siding traders in any case/claim they can have against their broker. If we consider that the case is severe, after helping the trader we remove the broker from our list. If it is not, we help the trader and keep the relationship with the broker.

    In the case of Mr. Ramsey, he came to me for help as he was not able to withdraw his money from CF. I personally intervine as got the compromise of CF’s CEO that Mr. Ramsey would receive his money back. Unfortunatelly CF did not meet its word, so the broker was removed from our list and I suggested Mr. Ramsey to take legal actions.

    We never have had any IB relationship with CF.

    We at FXstreet.com can make mistakes. Of course we do. But I can guarantee you our honesty. Next year is our 10th anniversary and we wouldn’t be here if we were not honest and good people.

    I want also you to know that we got ourselves trapped in the CF’s mess and they owe us money as well.

    I want you to understand too that we can’t take actions against any broker unless trader provide us with solid probes of his claims. Also, the trader wants his issue to be sorted out so we can’t make a big move - like removing a broker from the list - till the trader gets his case sorted out.

    I would really be very happy if my words have changed somehow your view.

    Francesc

74. on 31 Jul 2009 at 6:29 pm74Bukit Katil

    Whatever has happened I still support fxstreet as I get many information from this site. To Mr.Francesc and teams, keep up good work…

75. on 31 Jul 2009 at 7:06 pm75Francesc Riverola

    Hi Guys

    Sorry but I just returned from a week in Ireland.

    FX Pulp: as far as I know, FX Pulp was in business before Crown Forex S.A went down, but as there is a lot of talks about CF management now being behind FX Pulp, I’m going to ask them about it and leave things clear once and for all

    Francesc

76. on 02 Aug 2009 at 11:07 am76ishawish

    dear brothers,

    check the finma website concerned with crown forex
    http://www.crownforex.info

    can any body explain these information??

77. on 03 Aug 2009 at 1:41 pm77Ping

    http://www.crownforex.info says ” Due to the number of documents received, this will last several months. ”

    If it will last several months, when could we get the money .

    God save me.

78. on 03 Aug 2009 at 9:47 pm78Annie

    If i didn’t believe it before, I DEFINATELY believe it now. Crown HAS to be behind FXPulp. When i contacted FXpulp to find out who there management were, i used a completely different computer and email account. Today i received a direct email from a Rachelle.Matta to join their forex company to trade. The email explained their ‘benefits’ and low to zero spreads…etc.

    The email was sent to my account that i registered on Crown. I had not made any attempt to contact fxpulp for anything thru that account. The only way that this company could have gotten my information was from Crown and crown alone. They got a lot of nerve!

79. on 03 Aug 2009 at 10:22 pm79deedee

    I am very confused. I am a USA investor in Oxford Global Advisors, Minneapolis MN. Until July14, 2009, I and many others knew nothing about a problem with Crown Forex. We received daily email updates of our growth.

    Are our funds in tact? Will we received 100% back? When will that happen?

    I have sent documents to the attorneys listed, to Crown Forex, to FINMA, emails to all, and have received no response from anyone.

    I am a widow who invested all my money, who is now broke, and trying to figure out how to tell my son.

    Please tell me what is happening.

80. on 04 Aug 2009 at 4:37 pm80Tiger

    Hi Guys

    Another point of concern cominf from crownforex.info , the latest info posted on the website is concern, as FINMA saying no new accoutn or money accpeted but CROWN FOREX LLC is a different entity. see points

    Please note that:

    since December 9, 2008, Laurent WINKELMANN and Philippe von BREDOW are the only authorized legal representatives of CROWN FOREX SA ; no power of attorney have been delivered to any third person or entity since that date
    since December 9, 2008 no new client and no new account have been accepted by CROWN FOREX SA
    since December 9, 2008, Laurent WINKELMANN and Philippe von BREDOW have not authorized any reimbursement to investors in CROWN FOREX SA, in liquidation and that since December 24, 2008, the Swiss Financial market Supervisory Authority (FINMA), in order to insure equal treatment of creditors, has forbidden any reimbursement to investors.
    since May 19, 2009 at 8:00 (Swiss time), CROWN FOREX SA has suspended its activities and has accepted or received no fund from investors
    CROWN FOREX SA, in liquidation does not hold segregated bank accounts
    CROWN FOREX SA, in liquidation does not hold any account with ASSOCIATED BANK in the US
    CROWN FOREX SA, in liquidation and CROWN FOREX, LLC are two different and separate entities
    Account statements with false account numbers may have been issued in the name of CROWN FOREX SA in favour of persons who are not registered as client of CROWN FOREX SA, in liquidation. Account statements may therefore not be sufficient to substantiate the existence of a contractual relation or of a claim against CROWN FOREX SA, in liquidation.

    The last point about false account numbers , WHOA where is this coming now what is the status of our accounts, is it real or false and does that mean that whoever open account after FINMA got involves are false account and no hope for them.

    Sorry for being so sarcastic, but thats what I am experiencing so far.

81. on 04 Aug 2009 at 6:17 pm81deedee

    Our accounts were opened in 2007. Each day I received via email the activity on my account from the day before with a new balance. Once a month I received a monthly statement showing the past months activity. I had received funds requested as a draw in 2007, 2008, and as recently as June 16, 2009.

    If Crown Forex was closed down, how did I receive draws? And how can I have an account number?

    I emailed FINMA and received an answer stating what is on the website, but the reason for closing accounts was given as not complying to banking regulations, nothing about false account numbers or money not being there.

    What do you mean about not having an account number? What is Crown Forex LLC or Crown Forex SA? Is not Crown Forex the name of the company that FINMA is refering to?

    So, now I am even more confused and concerned. I have no more ideas as to where I can get answers or what to do now.

    Thank you for commenting.

82. on 04 Aug 2009 at 8:10 pm82Tiger

    Hi Deedee

    You said you withdraw funds as recent as of June 16th,2009 ????
    Is that true, as nobody else was able to withdraw since December 2008.

    Regarding false account number I am confused too , not sure whats the role of Crown Forex LLC, and how come the false account be able to trade on Crown Forex plateform under FINMA watch.

83. on 05 Aug 2009 at 3:16 am83CF Client

    Deedee I hate to be the bearer of bad news but it sounds to me like your funds were never deposited in Crown Forex SA.

    It seems like Crown Forex LLC was a separate entity created by someone else (maybe Oxford).

    If you received a withdrawal as recently as June 2009 your money is definitely not with Crown Forex SA in Switzerland.

    I believe the only one who knows where your money is would be Trevor Cook. He was the person in charge of this arbitrage strategy and could have been the creator of this Crown Forex LLC which LLC happens to be a USA entity.

84. on 05 Aug 2009 at 4:00 am84Annie

    Hi Tiger,

    Im from the U.S. I was reissued a new CF account December 10, 2008. I made a large deposit May 14, 2009. I have not received one thin dime since. The account was setup in Crown Forex SA. I know the difference between LLC (limited liability corporations). The bank that i made the deposit to was thru crown Forex SA. So based on your information, even tho i opened the day after the 9th of december and 4 days before the bankruptcy/liquidation….i still have the hope of getting something back??? Im more confused now than ever! As for deedee…..i hate to say it….but i requested funds one week before your last date and hadn’t heard nothing from nobody. I too think you may be registered under the LLC. Perhaps you can check your statements or the form for which you made your deposits or withdrawals that was given to you from ‘crown’. It should say it on the deposit request form you received from ‘crown’.

85. on 05 Aug 2009 at 5:26 am85Tiger

    Hi Deedee and Annie

    I am not sure of the status of LLC or no LLC, its the news for me coming from crwonforex.info website by FINMA.

    Deedee the confusing part for me is you said you have accoutn since 2007 and you were able to withdraw in june 2009, which is a mystery for me. I am not sure how you are able to withdraw in June 2009.

86. on 05 Aug 2009 at 5:10 pm86Hoosier

    Tiger

    Those funds were never deposited with Crown Forex SA

    As I understand the crux of the problem Oxford Global Advisors didn’t invest the funds with Crown and made up false account numbers, which seems to be the crux of the problem that is taking FINMA so long to unravel.

    My understanding is that those who had investments with Oxford have no recourse through Crown Forex becuase the funds were never invested with them.

    Thats my understanding

87. on 05 Aug 2009 at 6:38 pm87Goldy

    May be Oxford Global Advisors is another ponzi scam, similar to Madolf scam. The money they collect never invest, but they give fake statement, account number, and false earning. They keep collecting money from on person to pay another, until the whole pyramid scheme collapse.

88. on 06 Aug 2009 at 12:03 am88deedee

    All of my paper work states ‘Crown Forex SA’. Is there some way that I can find out where my money is? I don’t understand how I can have paper work that says CF SA and my money not deposited. Please try to help me.

89. on 06 Aug 2009 at 1:29 am89deedee

    Annie, Did you deal with people in Minneapolis MN, USA? deedee

90. on 06 Aug 2009 at 2:20 am90Goldy

    deedee,

    You may want to check out this article:
    http://www.startribune.com/business/51630292.html?elr=KArks7PYDiaK7DUoaK7D_V_eDc87DUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aU7DYaGEP7vDEh7P:DiUs

    At this time, the best person to contact and find out what’s going on or where is your money is your investment company that do the investment for you. So contact Oxford Global Advisors and ask them where the heck is your money if they never deposit at CF.

91. on 06 Aug 2009 at 8:36 am91Annie

    Deedee,

    I never dealt with anyone in USA. My money was deposited 4 days before the bankruptcy and i had an account back in december. I was unable to obtain any money since the deposit. In fact, i tried to locate an email from crown and received nothing since may. i was looking for a foreclosure home and needed a statement. Thats when i realize i never received a daily statement when i was asked to provide documentation for housing. When crown didn’t respond after a while, thats when i started looking for blogs about the the comapny. But my deposit was made thru Crown Forex SA.

92. on 06 Aug 2009 at 2:31 pm92ishawish

    dears….
    the trading platform of crown forex is stopped working since yesterday…did any one note this??

93. on 06 Aug 2009 at 5:09 pm93deedee

    I received daily email statements listed as coming from Crown Forex, including their return email adress. A few days ago I received a monthly statement for July showing my transactions up to July 16th, then stated ‘no further transactions’.

    I have sent another email to FINMA in hopes for more answers.

    Now, I just want to know where my money was deposited so that I know where to go to get it back.

94. on 06 Aug 2009 at 10:15 pm94Annie

    Ishawish…yes my trading platform is not connecting either.

95. on 07 Aug 2009 at 10:07 am95eagle

    Dear All,

    Unfortunatly CF has stopped the trading platfrom as expexted in my blog no 36 point #4 , i m still irritated from fxstreet dealing with Fxpulp, i can understand it s a source of income to fxstreet , but they are CF 100% , and i made a proof on blog no 51 but apparently No one want to probe it . Dear Francesc the income from fxpulp is not worth it to loose ur reputation.

96. on 07 Aug 2009 at 10:37 am96Francesc Riverola

    Dear Eagle

    I do not know if you would believe my word when I’m saying that I’ve never and I never will sell myself for a few thounsands more I can get from advertising.

    FXstreet.com has been here almost for 10 years and I’m planning to keep being here for many more to come. We have proven our honesty with daily hard work all these years.

    I’ve read all your posts about links between FX Pulp and CF as well as the posts from others.

    I’ve even contacted FX pulp top executive through an open letter and I’ve requested a list of board members names and shareholders.

    At this time, this is all I can do. In order to act right away, I need proves of the links between both companies, and unfortunatelly the fact they share the trading platform is not a solid prove to act. Many small brokers buy other’s platforms or just go with Metatrader as it is much cheaper than building their own.

    Believe me also when I say that I’m the most concerned of all this. As I previously said, to build our credibility has been a long and tough work and put it in jeopardy having not decent firms in my site scares me too much, but I can’t act unless I’ve got something solid to rely on.

    I hope you’ll understand my position.

    Thanks as always for sharing here your unbiased thoughts. I really like the people that comes forward and speak out their mind

    Francesc

97. on 07 Aug 2009 at 10:46 am97Francesc Riverola

    Dear Eagle,

    I’ve also contacted the chairman of the Cyprus Securities and Exchange Commission in order to get his help to sort out this issue.

98. on 07 Aug 2009 at 5:19 pm98Annie

    I understand eagles point. However Eagle, i cant fault Francesc for their acceptance of advertising for FXpulp….no more than i can fault Google for porn listings. I too tried to contact fxpulp for their board members and were told absolutely nothing. The lady just kept giving idiot reasons why i should join them. You can’t track every ‘believed’ scammer fully until their is some valid proof….otherwise we would be just another lynch mob. However, the consolation that i do have with Francesc’s site is that this was the only place where i found out what has happened to my crown account. Otherwise, i was completely in the dark. I’m still in the dark but at least i have just a quarters worth of battery light to see with! So for that i am grateful for the site. It doesn’t bring me comfort that my money may be gone or delayed forever but i can say that even by allowing you to post companies like fxpulp even under the cloud of suspicion, then thats a start to warn others until it comes to full light.

99. on 07 Aug 2009 at 7:29 pm99Hoosier

    I can also prove FX pulp are Crown or at least have a connection with Crown, because I have an ex directory phone number and there are only two forex companies that have that number one of them I still use and have an account with. The other is Crown Forex.

    Yesterday I received a telephone call from a sales lady from FX Pulp asking me if I want to open an account with them. She started flannelling when I asked her what connection they had with Crown forex.

    I don’t really think you need much other proof than that. There is definately a connection between these two companies

100. on 08 Aug 2009 at 6:21 am100Annie

     I dont doubt you. She must be using the crown listing of members because she contacted me too. I asked her the same thing…and she kept responding to me but not giving me any information at all other than to sell me in that system. But i dont blame FX Street. Maybe fxstreet can double charge fxpulp advertising and let us split the funds! hhahaahah Like a charity.

101. on 10 Aug 2009 at 11:19 am101Francesc Riverola

     Annie, I appreciate your sense of humour in all this rotten issue… thanks!

102. on 11 Aug 2009 at 5:28 am102Annie

     Well Francesc…thats all i have left when i been robbed! haha….sorry for that. When i’m really angry i laugh…probably because of the disbelief for the whole thing! hahaha So i’m not out to shoot the messenger:-)

103. on 11 Aug 2009 at 10:57 am103Francesc Riverola

     Annie… to put a smile at the dark side of life is a wonderful approach to life itself

104. on 11 Aug 2009 at 5:27 pm104deedee

     Does anyone know where the Crown Forex SA money is and when it will be returned. I only hear rumors. Does anyone know exactly how to find answers?

105. on 12 Aug 2009 at 11:12 am105Annie

     Well deedee, from what i read some comments above i’m waiting for the august date for crown to appeal. Hopefully that idiot wont. But if he does, I have plenty of time of spreading his name all over internet. Other than that, from what i can tell, no one has received any emails from FINMA. I get my info from this site and some of the other bloggers. However, i do plan on putting on my on youtube warning after that date. I figure what harm could it do. If it works for some of the individuals here in the states (like the angry United airline customer) and others, i think we should all do some kind of individual youtube comment about crown, about Finma and whomever involved. That way maybe, just maybe FINMA would reply to us in some kind of way. I haven’t received ANY information from FINMA. In fact, my own sister, who worked for the Chicago Board of Trade was doing a DEMO with crown some time ago and received an email from the liquidators with regards to the situation when it began. She happened to look in her box and there the email was. I on the other hand, had an actual account with CROWN and they didn’t send me any notice at all. So at this point, I consider my money lost so WHATEVER effort i put forth to get that money back, i feel i got nothing to loose because i already lost it. I have no shame in saying i lost over $20K. I’m sure there are more people who lost much more than that. But when the most you lost was $2,000 in ANYTHING in life, $20K is like a mountain. So I will be doing a series of youtubes after the august date mentioned above some time ago. So if there is any other information anybody want me to add to the youtube, feel free to let me know. I got nothing to loose.

106. on 12 Aug 2009 at 3:51 pm106deedee

     Annie, I did get an email answer from FINMA directing me to their website with the bankrucy information. Nothing after that. I understand that the date is 8/13/09, is this the same date you have. I did learn by reading Crown Forex’s website (I believe) that CF SA and CF LLC are two separate organizations. All my paperwork came from CF SA. I do agree that communication skills are not the best here. Please let me know when you are youtubing…deedee

107. on 13 Aug 2009 at 6:57 am107Annie

     There is another forum on fxstreet at this address: http://blogs.fxstreet.com/francesc/category/winds-of-change-in-switzerland/

     The deadline from what i’m reading is August 17th. I’m sure someone from this forum will post any add’l information after that date as to what is happening. So pending that info, i will wait until then. I actually do not visit the crown website anymore since a bug has been planted up their rear ends. I was at a kinkos internet store and the bug literally shut down their computers. So be careful. I get my info from here since i cant understand swiss.

108. on 13 Aug 2009 at 12:21 pm108haris

     I am really surprised that you guys d’nt know where is your money.

109. on 14 Aug 2009 at 1:36 am109Annie

     Feel free to let us know if you do.

110. on 23 Aug 2009 at 11:23 am110haris

     is there any update francesc.

111. on 24 Aug 2009 at 10:59 am111Francesc Riverola

     Haris… no news yet

112. on 26 Aug 2009 at 3:53 am112deedee

     I was told by my rep that the paperwork was accepted on July 17th and that a decision was to be before the end of September. I have no clue for what that means. I have contacted FINMA and get answers back to watch Crown Forex website for further updates. Real conversational people!!!

113. on 26 Aug 2009 at 8:09 am113haris

     It means that the decision is expected at the end of september.

114. on 26 Aug 2009 at 8:59 am114haris

     correction

     the date of accepting document should be 17 august not 17 july.

115. on 18 Sep 2009 at 11:11 am115Hoosier

     Its gone very quiet. I have tried FINMA without success. Anyone have any news?

116. on 18 Sep 2009 at 5:58 pm116Tiger

     Yup and last time I checked with FINMA liquidators, reponse is it to keep checking the http://www.crownforex.info.

     Not sure where the process is standing.

117. on 21 Sep 2009 at 5:01 am117chandra

     Be careful with this company (basel financial - http://www.baselfinancial.com). My instinct said this company is related to crown forex.

118. on 21 Sep 2009 at 4:02 pm118Goldy

     Yep, I think so too. Why in the world this BF has our email address and their ads are similar to CF.
     I’m not thrill to do any more business with broker oversea, especially those brokers in Cyprus.

     Anyway, I hope to hear good news from FINMA by the end of September.

119. on 22 Sep 2009 at 8:26 pm119Tiger

     The tricky part is on the website BF advertising Branch offices in Switzerland at the end of main page, but if you click on Switzerland for more or contact information , there is no details about Switzerland. -:)

120. on 23 Sep 2009 at 6:01 pm120vhanacek

     Crown Forex caught me on 1 pip spread on majors…..looks like it really worked because BF offers 0 pip spread for micro accounts.

121. on 27 Sep 2009 at 11:38 pm121Clint

     Francesc,
     I deposited monies after Dec 9th. Do you think that since the swiss bureaucracy had control of the account they would be responsible for my funds?

122. on 30 Sep 2009 at 8:03 pm122haris

     Hi guys,
     Has anybody got any news regarding the federal administrative court decision on crown forex bancrupcy? I heard the appeal of crown forex has been rejected. Can anyone confirm it?

123. on 01 Oct 2009 at 9:44 am123haris

     Hello Francesc!

     Is there any news about the case.

124. on 01 Oct 2009 at 11:44 am124Francesc Riverola

     Hi Haris

     From me, no news at all

     Francesc

125. on 01 Oct 2009 at 3:47 pm125Goldy

     I haven’t heard anything yet. I checked crownforex.info site, there is no update since July 30.

     Anyway, give them a few more days to sort thing out and post the update.

126. on 02 Oct 2009 at 10:58 am126clint

     Hello Francesc,
     I deposited monies after Dec 9th. Do you think that since the swiss bureaucracy had control of the account they would be responsible for my funds?

127. on 02 Oct 2009 at 11:34 am127Francesc Riverola

     Clint

     If I were you, I would put myself immediately in contact with Crown Forex liquidators

     Good luck

128. on 05 Oct 2009 at 10:44 am128faisal

     we are in to october now but yet no news from either finma or finma regulators.
     just dont understand whats on and whats more?
     is it ultimately mr.ibrahim ali will provide us with some infirmation?
     whats the delay?
     is it some deal bargain going on between crown and finma?
     guys getup from sleep,finma and crown should know that waiting eyes are focused right on them.
     i believe every body should start bombarding finma emails even if they are not responding.
     best of luck

129. on 05 Oct 2009 at 10:59 am129Francesc Riverola

     Faisal

     I am e-mailing them every two to three weeks. No luck so far

130. on 05 Oct 2009 at 11:31 am130Haris

     Hi guys
     I heard the decision is taken and appeal of crown forex is rejected, my IB spoke to shadi swaiss and he confirmed. The decision will be published on 15th oct. by finma. I called finma but they refused to give any kind of information.

131. on 05 Oct 2009 at 4:29 pm131faisal

     dear Haris,
     you might be right that decision is been taken,but it sounds very strange that decision will be published on 15th oct.decision is to be rendered by swiss federal court not finma.if swiss federal court have rendered its decision then it must be known to the media but yet no news yet from either reuters nor cnbc.
     anyways we are in to most strange case of this century,when many countries are providing bailout plans for their buisness and banks to save them from bankruptcy,this swiss authority finma is trying to impose bankruptcy on a firm which is ready to pump capital.cool isnt it.

132. on 05 Oct 2009 at 7:39 pm132haris

     Dear Faisal
     Yes i agree with you, but the court fully authorised finma whether to banckrupt or issue a banking liecence to crown forex,this is what i was told. We have no other option but wait we are stranded and it seems there is no authority in switzerland who could see this problem. as far as finma is concerned they dont even reply our mails nor they update us whats going on there. I think its time to take some serious action, we all victims should make a common plan to recover our funds. If any one have any better idea i am ready to act.
     regards

133. on 06 Oct 2009 at 4:32 pm133Clint

     Francesc,

     I have sent them numerous emails. Who should I contact?

134. on 06 Oct 2009 at 7:26 pm134Tiger

     I dont think FINMA will allow crownForex to go back in bussiness , it will be a slap on their face.
     On the other hand crown Forex interest is only to save their own money.

     To me nobody is sincere with clients, both of them have their own interest, if CFX ws doing anything wrong it shoulod be brought into front lights.

     Who knows what ? NO IDEA.

     We are on mercy of CFX and FINMA.Hoping and praying for the best for ourselves.

135. on 07 Oct 2009 at 10:00 am135faisal

     Tiger you very right
     crux of the matter is if Finma had decided that they have not to let cfsa working at any cost,then why crown clients are been put to torture for so long?
     does any of finma representative have moral courage to explain the question marks on their functioning?….ofcourse not.
     all the situation what we are witnessing from almost a year now,clearly shows some very mean mentality behind it.
     now if we are emailing finma,they are not responding.is it these finma representatives are not answerable to any body?
     these behaviours are more worst than even some dictatorial regime or some third world country or some closed socialist economy.

136. on 12 Oct 2009 at 4:57 pm136Hoosier

     Looks like this fiasco is going to take several more months to resolve. Of course the liquidators haven’t earn’t enough from this case already!!

137. on 13 Oct 2009 at 9:22 am137faisal

     guys i am almost certain that some kind of deal is been done between crown and finma…….and it seems like winkelmann and von bredow are busy in counting booty bucks captured through crown accounts….and most possibly mr.Ibrahim ali is busy in counting his share out of captured booty……..for me most satisfying thing is that i am part of this case and have witnessed real ugly face of this so called civilized economy.clearly recent economic turmoil is telling on the face of finma and swiss government………is it the birth of another soviet union in europe via switzerland?????may be not more than a decade

138. on 14 Oct 2009 at 1:30 pm138Haris

     Hye Faisal can u pls send me ur email address so we can coordinate case and make something out of it?

139. on 14 Oct 2009 at 1:31 pm139Haris

     Guys i want that we all victims should coordinate with each other to know the case further so we can talk abt this and maybe we can hire a lawyer together or individually to get out of this mess

140. on 14 Oct 2009 at 3:17 pm140faisal

     dear Haris it will not be proper to exchange email at this time but your idea to hire a lawyer is very much proper and discussable.
     i think we atleast require 50 clients to participate.and i am ready.
     its tough but not imposible!

141. on 14 Oct 2009 at 7:14 pm141Goldy

     Hello guys:

     Good ideas to get yourself a lawyer. However, in Switzerland, there is no group action case. So the lawyer will have to treat every case separately and they charge separately.
     Their fee can be one time fee, hourly fee, or share part of recovery fund, or combination with any of the above.

     You also need to know that even you get a lawyer, there is nothing much they can do until the case between FINMA and CF is finalized by the Swiss federal court.

     Once the court had decided to accept or reject CF appeal, then CF and their lawyer have the right to re-appeal the case to Supreme court. If CF decide not to re-appeal, then the case end, and FINMA can start to make announcement to the creditors (us). They then can start to liquidate CF asset and collect fund to pay creditors.

142. on 14 Oct 2009 at 7:39 pm142Hoosier

     Hi Goldy

     Sounds to me what your saying is there is little point using a lawyer full stop. As once the case has ended. A lawyer will make little difference to any proposed settlement.

     Do you agree?

143. on 15 Oct 2009 at 3:28 pm143Goldy

     Hello Hoosier:

     Sure lawyer can help is there is any problem during the settlement and if you want to sue CF directors for additional fund if after FINMA liquidate CF asset and you do not receive 100% of your money.

144. on 16 Oct 2009 at 9:27 am144faisal

     dear Goldy you are right and it seems almost impossible to fight any kind of fraud or misapropriation case against finma.
     i dont see anyone affording this case individually.
     do you think case is still continuing in swiss federal court?why finma is totally mouth shut when clearly delay is there?atleast they have some oblgation to inform the clients about the delay.
     although we clients are not in a position to do much but still i feel we should not sitback……..i have written one letter to my country’s embassy working in switzerland about the issue and one letter to my government……
     i think every client should inform to their concerned embassies working in suisse.

145. on 16 Oct 2009 at 3:33 pm145Goldy

     Faisal,

     If you want to sue FINMA, you should sue the Swiss government first, because they appointed FINMA to do this job.

     FINMA should have better communication to creditors, but this case, they do not give any update often enough.

     In the US, when CFTC is in the process of liquidating a firm, all legal proceeding are made public. Everyone can participate. Somehow, in Switzerland, it is between CF and FINMA, no public participation allow until the case close and CF no longer appeal.

     We have to wait and see. I am asking my lawyer to find out more. I will post update if I know any new development.

146. on 18 Oct 2009 at 7:21 pm146Sim Darwin Simon

     Dear Mr. Francesc Riverola, 19 October 2009

     I am also one of CROWN FOREX SA. Victims
     My account number with CROWN FOREX SA is 2460-15166.
     I had Funded since September 2008 and my latest balance
     still with Corwn Forex SA is USD 38,702.11

     Please kindly advise where whould I write and to claim back my fund?
     Shall I write to FINMA? Please advise their address & to whom shall I write my claim.

     Sincerely Yours, Sim Darwin Simon

     My detail address in Indonesia:
     Jl. Kapuk Pulo no. 108, Jakarta 11720
     tel +6221 619 1928, 619 4255 & 619 4251 - fax. 619 4254

147. on 19 Oct 2009 at 12:11 pm147hiks

     @Sim Darwin Simon
     Did you claim to FINMA before 30 June???
     read this link http://www.crownforex.info/
     it give you all information that i know:(

     try to contact them ASAP….hate them because this statement is not publish to crown forex website… why i wonder….

148. on 19 Oct 2009 at 12:39 pm148Francesc Riverola

     Dear Sim Darwin Simon

     As hiks very well said, put yourself immediately in contact with CF liquidators. Right away!

149. on 23 Oct 2009 at 4:06 am149Dgo

     Hi people
     all this seems to me we are the big losers….we are not going to get back our money…what a crap country is Suisse.
     I’m very mad, they stole our money and nobody does anything…they took the deposit when they were under investigation…I ‘am litteraly broke and they took my last money…I know the risk in Forex and I decide to take it but never I expected, this pz of sh…, will take the money and run away. I’m so frustrate….I don’t even want to think what I wuold do if they were here in front of me.
     Is not only the money they rape us….
     good night to all

150. on 23 Oct 2009 at 12:04 pm150faisal

     dear Dgo,your words truly are the sentiment of every client.
     the kind of treatment,we are being meted out is literally unpararleled.i can not find even one such example from around the world.
     i dont know where we are heading to?does these finma people have eyes or ears?i strongly doubt it now.
     they have taken hold over our money from a year now,and yet not ready to explain any thing to the clients.
     under what law all this is been happening?we are being made to believe that suisse is a lawless country,where finma is been given the authority to snatch money from any one at any time.

151. on 24 Oct 2009 at 12:19 pm151Dgo

     Hi Faisal
     Is well known Suisse has been for ever the paradaise for the bad and bloody money. They dont touch the deary money they just clean them and hide them from the law and live as a gentleman, I wuold call them gentelmen of white collar.
     We should have an entity in the US to write a class action letter to make them to help us becouse in Suisse this kind of litigation does not exist and no one of us can afford to pay a lawyer.

152. on 28 Oct 2009 at 4:32 pm152Goldy

     Dgo:

     I am also living in the US, so if you contact any US agency who can help push FINMA to speed up this process, let me know, I will join force with you. Please email me.

153. on 05 Nov 2009 at 11:57 am153Hoosier

     Goldy

     Does you lawyer have any update on the situation, I have managed to get absolutely nothing from FINMA

154. on 05 Nov 2009 at 4:03 pm154Goldy

     Nop, they refuse to talk to the Swiss lawyers too. Saying that all information is secret and cannot disclose to the public until the case is officially over and fund distribution start. So the lawyer said we have to wait until the fight between CF and FINMA is over. The sooner CF give up and the sooner the judge make his final decision,the sooner we will have all the information and will see the fund distribution. Until then, we are in the dark because of this Swiss secrecy law.

155. on 06 Nov 2009 at 7:24 am155Dgo

     Sorry Goldy but I’m a miserable mortal like any body here srugglyng with live and daily problems. I bet you if Bill Gates or Warren Buffet or one of this bigs name were involte in something like this they would have this problem resolved remember is only a matter of money….it is all about…If somebody can create a web site telling to the WORLD how nasty are this F…Suisse system if just one person like, I dont know, Ophra or Clinton or Bernake, could mention this Suisse Scam….I think we can have a choice to get our funds back, otherwise you can start saying….Hasta la vista babe….

156. on 06 Nov 2009 at 12:04 pm156Hoosier

     Thanks for the heads up goldy

     I take some comfort knowing it is not just me they are not talking to.

     DO they have any timescales as I was under the impression CF had given up and also if they are fighting this hard there must be something worth fighting for

157. on 08 Nov 2009 at 7:01 am157khawar

     Hi Guys,

     It’s almost a year of waiting with no result or any settlement initiated from FINMA. The CF mess is going on with no clues or news. The liquidators of CF failed miserably to safeguard the interest of investors in this case.

     In my opinion, the liquidators are milking the cash cow, and they are not satisfied yet with their greed to milk some more…Investors like us can wait forever!

     It seems to me they are doing exactly like any other lawyer, which is, put your personal interest first (Make money what ever you can make out of the case) since these kinds of cases don’t come by everyday…

     I am convinced that these lawyers or so called liquidators of CF are fully informed of the following risk statement:

     Risk Statement

     Trading foreign exchange on margin carries a high level of risk and may not be suitable for all investors. The high degree of leverage can work against you as well as for you. Before deciding to trade foreign exchange you should carefully consider your investment objectives, level of experience and risk appetite. The possibility exists that you could sustain a loss of some or all of your initial investment and therefore you should not invest money that you cannot afford to lose. You should be aware of all the risks associated with foreign exchange trading and seek advice from an independent financial advisor if you have any doubts.

     “YOU SHOULD NOT INVEST MONEY THAT YOU CANNOT AFFORD TO LOSE”…

     Indeed, it seems to me that this phrase is the focus of these liquidators, and to them, its ok with the investors of CF to lose since we can afford to lose….

158. on 10 Nov 2009 at 5:10 pm158Goldy

     Hello everyone,

     Yes it is frustrating that Swiss banking secrecy and other secrecy laws prevent FINMA from fully disclose all information while the case is in legal proceeding. However, we should not think that this is all negative.

     Swiss has a solid government and solid law, with centuries of financial and banking experience. I believe this case can be over quick or long is not resting so much on FINMA or the liquidators, it is how CF respond and how quick the Swiss federal court rule. If CF give up quickly, the case will be over quickly and the liquidation process can begin and investors should have their fund back. If CF continue to appeal and prolong this case, we can be waiting for a long while.

     Yes I believe CF have a lot of money stuck in the account when FINMA freez their asset, that’s why they are fighting so hard to regain control. It is not that they are concern about us the investors, but they want to grab the money and run.

     In this case, I am willing to wait if the money still under FINMA control instead of in the hands of CF crooks.

     I know many creditors are worry and give up hope, but I went through similar case before, it was a US firm got liquidated and I got fund stuck in there. However, after waiting for about a year, the receiver finally settle the case and another forex firm bought our accounts and we were allowed to withdraw 100% of our fund.

     So as long as fund is in FINMA’s hand, we have a very good chance of getting our fund back, just the matter of time. How much we will get, I don’t know, but looking at the way CF fighting so hard to regain control of the fund, we can summed that the asset or fund is quite large.

     Good luck to us all, and continue to fight, inform your government regulation agency, or do whatever to speed up this liquidation process.

159. on 11 Nov 2009 at 1:32 pm159faisal

     Goldy,it is good to see your optimism towards finma but believe me the kind of secrecy finma is been showing is totally unacceptable,it is not even human,rather i will call it most heinous crime which these corrupt regulators are committing…..mental torture.
     swiss financial system was known for its well defind and clear protective laws for creditors and investors.thats why creditors from across the world kept trusting this country.
     this economy was never under stress from many decades.but just recently the biggest swiss bank ‘credit suisse’have seen almost levels of default and swiss economy is also on the nose dive……and such kind of corrupt and greedy regulators surface in such economies….such a denial of infirmation to the actual victims….if you call it secrecy believe me it is unacceptable.

160. on 11 Nov 2009 at 4:14 pm160Goldy

     I am not happy with this secrecy law either. I also want to know what’s going on and I wish they update us every day. But we cannot blame the Swiss secrecy law on FINMA or the liquidators. THIS law exist LONG before FINMA and long before we have this problem with CF. If you want to repeal this secrecy law, you should lobby the Swiss legislators to remove it. Otherwise, keep blaming FINMA for the law that they doesn’t create is pointless.

     If you cannot wait for Swiss Federal court to settle this case, you should hire a lawyer, may be he can get you some information that FINMA cannot provide.

161. on 12 Nov 2009 at 6:11 am161Tiger

     I agree with Goldy on FINMA vs CF, there must be something special for CF which they are fighting for so hard. Instead of blaming FINMA I would blame CF for that , where is Ibrahim now, why is he being behind the scenes now.

     CF has lot of money stuck ( I beleive s0 but cannot say with 100 % surity ) and they are playing games, if they are sncere , than why not they jsut withdraw the case and let the money go out to clients and creditors, where it belongs too.

     FINMA/Liquidators is restricted by law to publicly announcing the details of the case, if CF management is honest or fair why dont they request the to have public hearings, because they have themselves requested to keep the case quite, as its in their interest.

     I myself is hopeless, helpless and frustrated with the situation but cannot do anything at this point.

     With regards to Liquidators , I usually send email to them once a month and gets the response back to ” keep checking the crownforex.info” website.

162. on 12 Nov 2009 at 9:43 am162faisal

     Tiger,i am also on the side of Goldy over the point that crown must have big assets under finma hold,thats why they are fighting so hard.point is we clients dont want to penetrate in to swiss “secrecy laws”.we were told that swiss federal court decision is expected in september,now we are two months across that time and they are not responding any emails,probably you are the only lucky one to get special attention from his “hihgnes” laurent winkelmann the great.

163. on 13 Nov 2009 at 5:59 am163Tiger

     Faisal

     I am in the smae boat as you, and have no idea when , what why and looking for answers myslef.

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